FACTORY FARMED ANIMALS TORTURED AND SLAUGHTERED TO FEED SO CALLED "COMPANION ANIMALS"

[Nath Miles]

It is becoming clear that as a society we are becoming more and more speciesist.

 

What do you think about those who feel it is completely ok to factory farm, torture and slaughter animals so as to feed them to sustain so called companion animals (dogs and cats) rather than having them put to sleep?

 

 

Does this not seem to be completely hypocritical?

 

Many prominent animal rights advocates struggle with this question.

With many feeling the best way forward is the one with the "least harm" to ALL animals.

If this is the case then it would appear that the "least harm" would then be to humanely put the huge over population of excess companion animals to sleep as to keep them alive and sustain them hundreds of animals would have to suffer and  die.

 

So why is it that our society has become so speciesist?

 

[Nath Miles]

This is worded perfectly Carolyn

"There are only two choices - continue denying an overpopulation problem, continue breeding domesticates into existence for the convenience and self indulgence of humans, and continue slaughtering millions of other animals every single year to do so, or, admit there is an incredible overpopulation of domesticates who are imprisoned as our "pets", for our own self indulgence, bred to be the "pets" we design, bred into a world which is unable to adequately accommodate them, and guess what? Then killed."

Well summed up.

[red dog]

Carolyn, thank you for scheduling a chat with Nathan Winograd. I'm really looking forward to it. When is it, by the way?

I think it's very misleading to suggest that anyone is in denial here--it's also misleading to say the homeless animal problem (at least in North America) stems from "overpopulation" or that no-kill supporters want breeding to continue. I don't know exactly where Winograd stands on this matter, and I'm interested in hearing him speak for himself, but I and many other no-kill supporters are 110 percent anti-breeding.

I'd be happy if ARZone could schedule a separate chat (or two) on vegan dogs and cats, but this seems like a very counterproductive way of addressing the issue (which I agree is also very important). As for some of the comments here, I think they do constitute an unfounded and libellous attack on Winograd.

[red dog]

Um, Tompkins County, the shelter he oversaw for two years?

The rest of your post is nothing more than an ad hominem attack. Why can't you back up your statements with facts?

[red dog]

Why do you keep twisting the truth and suggesting that anyone who disagrees with you supports breeding? We disagree on how to stop breeding-- your way = laws that don't work and have unforeseen consequences vs. Winograd's way = shelters that do a good job. Stop misrepresenting what this debate is about.

[Nath Miles]

Anyway i feel that all animals are equal. And we need to pick the path of the least harm to all animals.

The current situation is clearly not ensuring that animals recieve the least harm and its not working.

So we need to look at the bigger picture.

Also the other factor we all need to remember is that apart from the animal cruelty, suffering and death that is occuring all these companion animals have a carbon footprint. So it is not in the planets best interest to continue the status quo.

A scientific study carried out recently has concluded that

Pet Cats have a carbon footprint equivalent to a small Volkswagons driving around for a year. (this includes (trap neuter released / dumped cats)
Pet Dogs of a medium size have a carbon footprint equivalent to a SUV driving around for a year.

So 150,000,000 animals equates to at the minimum 150,000,000 small cars per year on the road and thats in America only.

[red dog]

Humans are also the only ones who can change things, and people like Nathan Winograd are taking society a step forward. Nath is trying to push us back into the dark ages.

[Nath Miles]

Tomkins County has been a failure.

Stuck with Winograd’s dysfunctional system, by August 2007, the Tompkins County SPCA had become overcrowded with too many animals to handle. In fact, the facility was so overcrowded that animals were being stashed in the kitchen and laundry room. By 2008, the towns of Lansing and Groton both had opted out of their animal control contracts with Tompkins County SPCA, citing the high cost of doing business. Then, in 2009, Tompkins County SPCA lost animal control contracts with the towns of Dryden and Lansing after the the shelter increased its fees to compensate for financial trouble. By November 2009, Tompkins County SPCA had become overrun by cats and turned to community rescuers and foster homes to alleviate the population burden. And in February 2010, Tompkins County SPCA found itself again overcrowded after 100 animals were rescued from a local hoarding household.

http://4k2.org/blog/nathan-winograd-in-tompkins-county/

[Carolyn Bailey]

Hi red dog,

Nathan Winograd's chat is in the new year. We're looking forward to it as well.

I understand that, regardless of the position most people take on domesticates, we all agree that purpose breeding is wrong. I don't know what the answers are, we've discussed this a lot lately, and I'm not sure any answers are acceptable. I do, however believe there is an overpopulation of domesticates in Australia, which needs to be addressed.

We have another "open forum" discussion on January 1/2, in which we will hopefully address this as one of our topics.

I really do understand it's a passionate topic, all I ask for is civil discourse from all participants.

[red dog]

So many of your links have the word "blog" in the URL, don't they? Hopefully Winograd will address this question in the chat.

[Nath Miles]

Carolyn,

The problem with the pro winograd people is they deny there is an over population.

And this ignorance and stupidity is causing more harm than they can comprehend.

It gives the green light to breeders
It gives people the belief that hey its ok not to desex your cat or dog

The "winograd version of no kill" is a complete contradicition of itself.

It is very hypocritical to say there is no over population then to say but hey we need to promote free desexing. If there is no over population then there is no need to desex.


It is also completely hipocritical. If there is no over population then there is no need to desex your dog or cat is there?

[red dog]

It's not the topic, it's the person and his dishonest posting style. What's civil about suggesting someone has ties to breeders, dogfighters and other animal abusers when you have no proof other than innuendo and rumours posted to various blogs?

[red dog]

More lies and distortions ... where to start ...